From champerbu@aol.com Fri Mar 3 17:04:47 EDT 1995 Article: 29476 of rec.climbing Xref: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU rec.climbing:29476 Path: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU!metro!news.cs.su.oz.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!msunews!uwm.edu!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!uunet!in1.uu.net!newstf01.news.aol.com!newsbf02.news.aol.com!not-for-mail From: champerbu@aol.com (ChamperBU) Newsgroups: rec.climbing Subject: Re: Use Radios on rocks/ice? Date: 21 Feb 1995 22:25:31 -0500 Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Lines: 11 Sender: root@newsbf02.news.aol.com Message-ID: <3iearb$ef1@newsbf02.news.aol.com> References: Reply-To: champerbu@aol.com (ChamperBU) NNTP-Posting-Host: newsbf02.mail.aol.com I tried to use a radio at Seneca Rocks, WV. The biggest problem was getting line-of-sight communications. The rescue officials often have repeaters at high points around a region, we have only the receiver in our pockets. It made for some confusing leading over broad ledges. At one point, we just shut the damn things off. Who knows, maybe I just bought a cheap radio ($100) --> Chris Champion just call me sparkplug >:) From hubbert@minerva.cis.yale.edu Fri Mar 3 17:04:54 EDT 1995 Article: 29610 of rec.climbing Xref: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU rec.climbing:29610 Path: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU!metro!news.cs.su.oz.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!msunews!caen!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!gumby!yale!yale.edu!news.ycc.yale.edu!hubbert From: hubbert@minerva.cis.yale.edu (sparks) Newsgroups: rec.climbing Subject: Re: Use Radios on rocks/ice? Date: 25 Feb 1995 04:04:49 GMT Organization: Yale University Lines: 20 Message-ID: <3ima91$flg@news.ycc.yale.edu> References: <3iearb$ef1@newsbf02.news.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: mercury.cis.yale.edu X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] : I tried to use a radio at Seneca Rocks, WV. The biggest problem was : getting line-of-sight communications. The rescue officials often have : repeaters at high points around a region, we have only the receiver in our : pockets. It made for some confusing leading over broad ledges. At one : point, we just shut the damn things off. Who knows, maybe I just bought a : cheap radio ($100) Try some better radio's. The radio's jim and I use are the Kenwood th78-a's they're about $400 and line of sight is pretty good (Lost arrow tip in Yosemite to camp 4), and within a rope length there is no problem with non-line of sight. I even used them skiing at Mammoth and was always in touch. The above was all "line of sight", when using a repeater you can expect much longer ranges (JT to Palm Springs and beyond) : --> Chris Champion : just call me sparkplug >:) --sparks just call my sparky =:-] From tom@u.washington.edu Fri Mar 3 17:05:32 EDT 1995 Article: 29727 of rec.climbing Xref: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU rec.climbing:29727 Path: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU!metro!news.cs.su.oz.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!newshost.marcam.com!uunet!in1.uu.net!nntp.cac.washington.edu!tom From: tom@u.washington.edu (Tom Bunch) Newsgroups: rec.climbing Subject: Re: Use Radios on rocks/ice? Date: 27 Feb 1995 23:41:55 GMT Organization: Columbia River Salmon Project, CQS, U. of Washington Lines: 22 Message-ID: <3ito03$efr@nntp1.u.washington.edu> References: <3ima91$flg@news.ycc.yale.edu> <3irpua$97c$1@mhadf.production.compuserve.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: saul2.u.washington.edu In article <3irpua$97c$1@mhadf.production.compuserve.com>, Marc Schwager &/or Allison Ash <72733.2301@CompuServe.COM> wrote: >reasonably strong wind. It gets dicey using rope signals on thin >[...]tuff. The downside however, is I "went down ten points on the >god-meter" according to my partner. She had never heard how much I >cursed, bitched, and moaned as I thrashed up the rock. Same way my partner learned that I tend to whistle while I lead. >My final view is that they were great in windy conditions. You >really need a full duplex set. You also need a small unit. It also helps to have a hand-free headset. :) I found that it was nice to be able to converse in easy, conversational tones even when shouting was no good. But I also found that wearing a headset was a royal pain. And also that, because it was easy to talk, my second asked for a constant stream of beta. "How'd you get past this?" "I dunno, where are you? Try pulling up on some of the holds or something." -Tom From hubbert@minerva.cis.yale.edu Fri Mar 3 17:05:46 EDT 1995 Article: 29832 of rec.climbing Xref: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU rec.climbing:29832 Path: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU!metro!news.cs.su.oz.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!msunews!uwm.edu!math.ohio-state.edu!caen!zip.eecs.umich.edu!panix!cmcl2!yale.edu!news.ycc.yale.edu!hubbert From: hubbert@minerva.cis.yale.edu (sparks) Newsgroups: rec.climbing Subject: Re: Use Radios on rocks/ice? Date: 2 Mar 1995 04:38:58 GMT Organization: Yale University Lines: 10 Message-ID: <3j3i52$amj@news.ycc.yale.edu> References: <3ima91$flg@news.ycc.yale.edu> <3irpua$97c$1@mhadf.production.compuserve.com> <3j2vlp$28v@nntpd2.cxo.dec.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: mercury.cis.yale.edu X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Or better yet, you could train turkey vultures to fly messages back and forth. Or better yet, climb with a 50' rope. Modern radios weigh mere ounces and the big advantage is being able to communicate with others in case of disaster. I've never used my radio for a rescue, but I'm sure glad it's there. --sparks From grimpeur@VNET.IBM.COM Fri Mar 3 17:06:01 EDT 1995 Article: 29847 of rec.climbing Xref: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU rec.climbing:29847 Path: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU!metro!news.cs.su.oz.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!newshost.marcam.com!uunet!juniper.almaden.ibm.com!VNET.IBM.COM From: grimpeur@VNET.IBM.COM (Jim Rogers) Message-ID: <19950302.142024.969@almaden.ibm.com> Date: Thu, 2 Mar 95 15:39:00 CST Newsgroups: rec.climbing Organization: Archeological (lower strata contain older files) Subject: Use Radios on rocks/ice? References: <3j2vlp$28v@nntpd2.cxo.dec.com> <3ima91$flg@news.ycc.yale.edu> <3irpua$97c$1@mhadf.production.compuserve.com> Lines: 32 susswein@anrchy.cxo.dec.com (Steve Susswein) suggested: ... |What I had in mind was a thin 2-strand wire running through the rope |(possibly coiled, so it could stretch with the rope) with a miniature |jack at each rope end. It's feasible, but speaking as an electrical engineer, I doubt it'd be very practical. I thought of the same sort of thing some time ago, but the rope stretch is a pretty big problem to overcome. You'd have to run stranded wires with really thin strands, with the wires coiled around a pair of rope strands in the core, or maybe woven into the sheath somehow. Overstretch just once and it's gone. One thing is certain: embedding a reliable wire would drive up the cost of your rope, probably a lot, and your rope is something you need to replace periodically so that would be an ongoing cost. From a practical standpoint it makes much more sense to keep it an independent system (or if it relies on any costly periodic-replacement gear, design around non-modified gear or dirt-cheap modifications). A possible safety question to address is whether an embedded wire would expose a climber to increased lightning risk, by reducing the static electrical potential difference (relative to ground) between the endpoints. Lightning's usually not a huge climber's exposure (compared to everything else we do), but when I was bailing off of Devil's Tower the Summer before last with an impressive electrical storm bearing down on us, I wouldn't want to have given it any encouragement. Jim ------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Courage is not the absence of fear, but rather the judgment that something else is more important than fear." -- Ambrose Redmoon From Clyde_Soles@nile.com Fri Mar 3 17:06:54 EDT 1995 Article: 29845 of rec.climbing Xref: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU rec.climbing:29845 Subject: Re: Use Radios on rocks/ice? Date: Thu, 2 Mar 95 09:31:21 MDT Message-ID: <001C8188.fc@nile.com> X-FirstClass: 0x59F8 0x001C8188 0x000F4B1A 0x000F4B1A 0x0000 Newsgroups: rec.climbing Path: dmssyd.syd.dms.CSIRO.AU!metro!news.cs.su.oz.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!msunews!uwm.edu!vixen.cso.uiuc.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!swiss.ans.net!potogold.rmii.com!nilenet!Clyde_Soles From: Clyde_Soles@nile.com (Clyde Soles) Organization: NileNet Limited X-HoloGate: 1.1.2 [J3Z8-QTJJ-WNX-RJZ] Lines: 12 In message ID <3j2vlp$28v@nntpd2.cxo.dec.com> on 3/1/95, Steve Susswein wrote: > What I had in mind was a thin 2-strand wire running through the rope (possibly > coiled, so it could stretch with the rope) with a miniature jack at each rope > end. You could then use a cheap, simple, and light intercomm type device for > communication, instead of a radio. Power requirements would be a lot less, > and line of sight issues wouldn't exist. > > Any thoughts? The company that made this went bankrupt about ten years ago.